Thomas and Marcy Rice of Henrico/Hanover Virgina

This is a working document by Linda Martino martino@pobox.com
Collaborator Sharon Whitehead.
Y-DNA funding and help Alice Ramer Rice Bratcher and Mary Elizabeth Rice Harris
Additional information, theories, and corrections welcome.

Who were the Thomas and Marcy Rice descendants? They were preachers and teachers - especially the David branch. They were also lawyers and doctors. A lot were land speculators, some adventurers on expeditions with Daniel Boone and of course farmers. Their children moved out of Hanover into many surrounding VA counties. The next generations moved NC, SC, KY, TN, KY and MO. Many in that generation fought in the Revolutionary War or gave aid. The following generation moved to GA, AL, IL, and on to TX. They are an American story and a migration of the southern part of the US starting in the late 1600s.

Layout and organization of the tree: I have used brown boxes for each child of Thomas and Marcy to separate each child. Due to the size of this page I have created detailed pages for some of the children and this page will have the names of their children (grandchildren of Thomas and Marcy).
William , James , Thomas , Edward , Mary , John , Alice , Marcy , David ,Susannah , Benjamin , Matthew , ?Joseph .
The last section contains the Y-DNA testers. Some are incorparated into the tree but some we know although they belong in the tree but not how. Their brown boxes show the oldest known ancestor for each tester and a couple of generations of their descendants. Each of those sections are floating looking for a home in the tree. The Thomas Rice Y-DNAs testersnfall currently in 3 Haplogroups. Links to the more detailed Haplogroups based on a Big Y are: R-FGC17119 , R-M6586 , R-FGC17108 and the more general Haplogroup group for lower levels of Y-DNA testing is R-M269

Working Document

This pdf document contains much of the facts I have found which help date people etc. It incluses Personal Tax Records form 1782 on when the US really became a government. Included are census, land, legal, marriages and what ever else

Inaccurate or speculative trees often conflict with each another on ancestry.com and elsewhere. This is working page is an effort to sort what is supported by documents or Y-DNA testing and use a ? to indicate what is speculative. Many Rices from the south think they descend from Thomas and Marcy. Although they left a lot of descendants all VA Rices do not descent from them. There are many other Rices in VA such as the Middlesex Rices which are a different group. Y-DNA also tells us we have zero connection to Edmund Rice of MA. More than 50 Thomas descendants are in our group 4 of the Rice ftdna Y-DNA project. 11 have have taken the higher level test called a Big Y. Actually descendants for any Thomas brothers or paternal uncles etc could be in the group not just Thomas' descendants but so far we are only seeing Thomas descendants and not descendants of any potential male relatives such as brothers.

Format is: a persons name birth b. and death d. dates and location, a m. for each marriage with date and location of the marriage followed by the name of the spouse followed by the spouse's birth and death dates and location and perhaps the spouses parents. Multiple wives will each have a m. section for each. Here is an example.
William B Rice b. 24 Apr 1744 Hanover VA d. 1 Mar 1838 Montgomery County, MO m.  31 Aug 1781 Rebecca Arlington b. 1 Mar 1758 d. 28 Jun 1846 Montgomery County, MO

This is a working document and I have lots more details to add as I research each part of the tree. Some parts of the tree below the grandchildren of Thomas and Marcy have not been vettedl. Other parts I have vetted quite a bit but have not vetted all details. The order of the numbers for children does NOT indicate order of birth. Most people in the 1700s have no known birth dates. Most birth dates are just speculation based on census, age of children, adult or not an adult in a will, and the assumption a man is at least 21 when he starts a buys land etc. some Personal Tax Records can start as young as 16..Numbering the children is to make the tree more visually clear. I bold children under a brown box couple and then indent/nest the grandchildren with numbers starting with one again.

In some cases a will does not name all his children. I am adding an asterisk to the children who are actually listed when we know not all are listed. For example both Edward and his son Charles named some but not all children.

Dower rights vs dowry. Many do not understand the 2 terms. A Dower is a common law that entitled a widow to a portion of her husband's estate in absence of a will. In most circumstances, the widow was granted up to one-third interest in her husband's assets. In a deed when a woman relinquishes her dower rights means she agrees to the deed sale and will not come back after her husband's death and claim she owns 1/3 of the land that was sold in the given deed. It does not imply the land was given to her husband by her father and the sale did not imply the buyer was her father or the land was a dowry. You commonly see if there is a will it gives the wife gets 1/3 until her death or remarriage. The will may state what happens to the 1/3 when she dies or remarries.

So far following Wills, deeds and other known information along with Y-DNA testing. I have found the following incorrect trees.

Y-DNA Testing

Autosomal testing is useful 6 to 8 generations back. Therefore autosomal testng is not very helpful going back to Thomas and his sons for determing which son a grandson of Thoasas descnds through. But Y-DNA goes back thousands of years and the best tool we have to determine what grandsons descend through which son of Thomas and can help with the gaps in our paper trail.

Y-DNA testing can be complicated and confusing. Here are some basics about the results.

  1. The Y-DNA Rice Project Group 4 contains people who uselully descend from Thomas Rice of Hanover. Does that mean every person in the group is a direct descendant of Thomas ?
    1. A person in that group could be a direct descendant of a close male relative of Thomas such as a brother or male paternal cousin etc. But to date we have no paper trail or indication of a close male relative to Thomas vs Thomas himself but it is a possibility.
    2. We do know testers not in Group 4 do not descend from Thomas or a close male relative of Thomas.
    3. Some testers fit in the min and max numbers for each marker in Group 4 and are placed in that group. But they have a lot of mutations so the genetic distance makes it unlikely they descend from Thomas and Mary. We have 2 Group 4 testers who have a large number of mutations from the normal values.
      1. 663204 Benjamin Reynolds B. 1796 South Carolina D.1870 KY at Y-67 is a 7 genetic distance which makes it possible but unlikely that he is connected.
      2. 286865 John Bryant Rice b. 1791 SC d. 1866 Covington, AL at Y-37 is a 6 genetic distance which makes unlikely that he is connected.
      3. Either may connect further back in time but a Big-Y would be neeed to explore that.
  2. Matches list a Genetic Distance between testers which can have anomalies where testers can appear closer or further than they actual are. A match with a Genetic Distance of 0 is not necessary a closer match then with a tester with Genetic Distance of 1.
  3. Haplogroups from the Big Y have no such anomalies and SNP results are much more stable than STRs. Currently John has a Big Y mutation called Haplogroup R-FGC17108 and that mutation is only cared by his direct descendants. The lower level testing does not provide that level of accuracy.

Detailed explanation below for those who need details and the whys of the basics.

Y-DNA Rice Project . Thomas Rice of Hanover descendants are group 4. All other testers in other groups are unrelated.
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/rice?iframe=ycolorized
The testers in other groups are not related to Thomas but their tester trees may not be accurate. So care must be taken to exclude their stated ancestor as a candidate ancester for a Group 4 tester. For a large group with a variety of testers such as Group 7 with good paper trails, we know a tester in Group 4 does not descend from Henry Rice, the Tennessee Grist miller (1717-1818). For a small Group 7A with 3 testers who do not all seem related, we need be skeptical of their trees until more testers appear in the group. A tester in Group 7A says he descends from Benajah Rice but a single tester means we should not automatically exclude Benajah Rice as related to Thomas until their are more varied testers.

Explanation of Y-DNA testing anomolies and the value of the Big Y. The two measures in Y-DNA testing SNPs and STRs

The only way to obtain the most detailed Y DNA haplogroup is to take a Big Y test. The Big Y test scans the Y chromosome to search for SNP mutations. The Big Y test doesn’t test any one specific location, like STRs but scans for all mutations – currently known and previously unknown. STR markers alone are inconclusive at best and potentially deceptive

  Number of SNP Markers Number of STR Markers Haplogroup
37 to 111 37 to 111 SNPs 37 to 111 STRs R-M269 - 92.3% of Wales men - 4,000 to 10,000 years ago
Big Y 700 ~ 70,000 SNPs 700 plus many more bonus STRs R-FGC17119, R-M6586, R-FGC17108 - 200-300 years
  1. SNPs Single nucleotide polymorphisms: DNA markers are one of 4 amino acids: adenine (A) and thymine (T), guanine (G) and cytosine (C) With only 4 possible values at each marker huge number of men share the same value at any one marker. SNPs determine Haplogroups. The value of the amino acid at a marker can mutation from a T to an A for example. I think of that as a big mutation and is not frequent. Once it mutates from T to A it almost never mutates from A back to T.
    The Haplogroups and Tree of Life is solely determined through SNPs and not STRs. A tester has a SNP marker mutation that only occurs in their test- is called a "private variant". If a second tester has the same mutation then the SNP is named and a new Haplogroup is formed. Typically today its through the more extensive Big Y that new SNP mutations common to at least 2 testers result in new Haplogroups as those in the 111 have already been named. We have 3 such Haplogroup in the Thomas Group 4 of the Rice DNA Y-DNA project. There are more Haplogroups in Group 4 to be discovered as more Big Y tests occur.
    Once someone tests at a Big Y and they get their results, if they have an unnamed private variant which is the same private variant as a previous tester, it will take some time for the experts at ftdna to verify and name the private variant as a new SNP and create a new Haplogroup
  2. STRs Short tandem repeats: SNP mutations are not common so a count of repeats of some SNPs called STRs are a second measure. The mutate more frequently than SNPs. For example a sequence could be AAAATTTTTTTTCCC. The first marker has a repeat of 4 , the second marker 8 and the last 3. The numbers you see in Y-DNA charts like 12, 13 etc is the number of repeats at that marker. If the number of repeats change like from 12 to 13 I think of that as a small mutation compared to the SNP mutation of the amino acid itself like T to A.
    1. STR markers are selected because they have repeats which vary in mutation rates usable in the date range we are concerned with. As each group was added 12 to 25 to 37, in the new groups they selected markers with a mix of mutation rates. If a marker has repeats but it only changes the STR number every 10,000 years it is not useful to us so it is not selected as a STR marker. Not all SNPs are also used as STRs.
    2. Genetic Distance is simply the count of STRs that are different between the 2 testers. It counts the number of STRs at the lowest level of both testers tested. If one is 111 and one a Big Y then they compare the 111 markers. If both are the Big Y they compare all 700 plus. So when looking at matches look at how many STRs were compared as well as the number of differences. Since STR marker's have different mutation rates, the "time predictor chart" for 2 different matches with the same Genetic Distance can have different probabilities of distance to the common ancestor. Same if they tested at the higher rate of STRs. Look at the Time Predictor button on the far right to see the probabilities in the Y-DNA TiP Report which take these factors into account.
    3. Why can a match of zero Genetic Distance be further away than a match of one Genetic Distance? Because STRs can mutate in both directions. The SNPs do not usually mutate back to the original value but STRs can go in one direction and then back to the original value over the many generations from 1700 to today - especially for markers with faster mutation rates. It can be misleading and confusing to testers looking at results. My Rice tester has a match with a Genetic Distance of zero to a descendant of Matthew but a Genetic Distance of one to a decent-ant from tester who descends from David as does Rudy.
    4. The order of your matches for a 111 test may be different than the Big Y. The 111 test looks at only 111 SNPs and the Big Y looks at 800+/- SNPs so the Genetic Distance can be a different order as to closeness.

The example below illustrates how Genetic Distance can have anomalies. The marker numbers and values are just made up numbers to illustrate the issue. We will assume for this example 109 markers are identical for the 4 testers. Only marker #66 and marker #723 vary between the 2 testers. The number of STRs vary for marker 66 and the SNP for marker 723 in the Big Y.

Gen 1 Thomas # 111 T 14 STRS - .# 723 A
Gen 2 John b. 1688 marker # 66 T 14 STRs, and marker # 723 T Edward marker # 66 T 15 STRs, and marker # 723 A
Gen 3 # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A
Gen 4 # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A
Gen 5 # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 A
Gen 6 # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 13 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 A
Gen 7 # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 13 STRS - .# 723 T # 66 T 15 STRS - .# 723 A # 66 T 14 STRS - .# 723 A
  Tester 1 Tester 2 Tester 3 Tester 4
  1. In this example John has a big mutation at marker 723 where its a T not the normal A. All other descendants of Thomas have A and only John's have a T. We have 4 real testers with that mutation and they now have their own Haplogroup R-FGC17108. Remember SNP variation result in Haplogroups.
  2. But marker 66 which is part of the 111 marker does not have an amino acid big change but its number of STRs smaller mutations. That marker mutates more frequently than most markers and in this example it mutates in both directions.
  3. Edward has such a mutation and one occurs at Gen 6 for John and one at gen 5 for Edward's descendants.
  4. Looking only at the 111 part tester 1 and tester 4 look closer then they are to the other testers. But the Big Y tells us Tester 1 and 2 descend from John and Tester 3 and 4 do not. SNPs do not create anomalies but STRs can.

Even though I made up numbers for this example, John does have a SNP mutation which creates Haplogroup R-FGC17108. So any Big Y tester means can rule John in or out as their ancestor.

So why do a Big Y as its expensive? In our Group 4 the testers are more closely bunched than typical at the 111 level. Two testers can descend from different sons of Thomas and be identical at 67 or even 111. STRs mutate much more often and sometimes back mutate to the original value which in essence looks like a mutation never happened. Sometimes STR markers mutate to the same value independently, meaning that two men share the same mutation – making it look like they descend from the same line – but they don’t. The Big Y scans for all mutations amd is more reliable. If you think you have a good paper trail as to how you connect to Thomas and Marcy you can help verify your paper trail but it also helps those who do not yet know how they connect. And of course if you do not know how you connect, the Big Y may help.

The Thomas Rice Haplogroup R-FTB38469 starts from Africa and reached Wales in the Iron Age.

 

Gen 1 Thomas Rice Marcy
Birth 1650-60 England
Death by 1711 lost at sea 1722
Marriage 1679 New Kent Co. Va
  1. William Rice b. ca 1684 d. by 6 Dec 1734 Hanover m. Elizabeth
  2. James Rice b. 4 Apr 1686(B)
  3. Thomas Rice b. 24 Jun 1688 (B) d. 2 Apr 1744-28 Jan 1745/6 Hanover m. Joyce
  4. Edward Rice b. 17 Apr 1690(B) d. 1 May 1769 - Oct 1770 m. Mary Claiborne
  5. Mary Rice b. 15 Jul 1694(B) m. John Sims
  6. John Rice b.18 Sep 1698 (B) m. Mary
  7. Alice Rice b. 27 Sep 1700 (B) no further record
  8. Marcy Rice b. 5 Jul 1702 (B) no further record
  9. David Rice m. Susannah Searcy
  10. Susannah Rice m. 1730 Thomas Hart Jr.
  11. Matthew Rice d. by May 1775 m. Ann unknown & m. Ann McGehee
  12. ?Joseph Rice d. 16 Jun 1766 (P) m. Rachel
  13. Benjamin Rice

Comments

Suggested other children: Trees suggest:

  1. A daughter Elizabeth Rice m. Richard Bennett . They had 2 sons with the name Rice in it and that seems the reason for adding her. But Richard has a birth date and location of Middlesex VA. The Rice family of Middlesex is unrelated to Thomas and Marcy so Elizabeth may belong to them.
  2. A son Francis is suggested too. He is not a son based on Y-DNA testing.
  3. Henry Rice is proposed as a son of Thomas and Marcy. The Henry Rice they say was b. 1717, lived and married in Spotsylvania VA, moved to Pickens SC then and died 1818 in Union Co TN. This Henrey is exluded based on Y-DNA testing.
  4. David (who maried Susanna Swarcy) and Mathew are brothers and sons of Thomas and Marcy as identified by David's grandson through his son Benjamin. Based on their closeness Jospeh is likely 9th son of Thomas and Marcy. The birth order of David, Matthew, and Jospeh is unclesar since their are no birth records from Hanover. David's eldest son Jesse was born ca 1730. Matthew's son Matthew was born ca 1735 and Joseph's son David ca 1731. The ages of the later 2 are based on Personal Tax records in Amelia Co VA when they came of age at age 16. Jesse's birth year is a guess based on the birth years for his sons. He could be a bit older. Davis is likely the oldest of the three but its a toss up between Joseph and Matthew. I have put Matthew first solely based on him moving to Amelia/Prince Edward Co first but based on the birth of their first son it could easily be reversed.

Hanover late 1700s:

  1. In the late 1700s HanThomas_Rice_Williamover there are only 3 Rice men who paid land taxes in Hanover. The tax records start in 1782.
    1. One is Jesse Rice son of David who is in St. Martin's district. He leaves his farm to 2 of hs three sons. They stay there and they have children staying in the area of Beaverdam.
    2. One is a Charles d. 22 Mar 1811 Louisa VA m. ? ?Garland m. 22 Dec 1808 Louisa Sarah Lipscomb Will He bought land in Hanover in 1786 and labled as fron Caroline. Paid taxed 1787 -1800. He buys land in Louisa 1799 and the remaining records are in Louisa. He may not be in the faily. Although Caroline is neaby Hanover no other Rice's in th family seem to be there.
      1. Nancy Garland Rice b. 7 Feb 1807 Louisa Co VA d. 23 Oct 1864 Springfield, Washington County, KY m. Anthony Mcelroy
      2. Mary Ann Rice b. 1811 d. after 1860 m. 10 Sep 1827 Abraham Perkins m. 12 Feb 1839 Louisa VA Nathaniel Holland
    3. The third is Nathaniel Rice who has land 1782 to 1800 when he sells the land.
    4. In the late 1700s Hanover the separate personal property records in St Paul's district with a few Rice's: Holman 82-85, Nancy 94-95, Samuel 98-1800

Caswell Co NC (originally Orange Co) mid to late 1700sq

  1. grandchildren of 4 and perhaps 5 of the 12 children of Thomas and Mary moved to Caswell county NC along with their daughter Susannah Rice Hart herself.
  2. The first to come was Susannah Rice Hart's family by the late 1750s. It was called Orange Co NC but the part the family bought land became Caswell Co in 1777.
  3. Thomas Rice Jr/Esq/Sheriff. In Feb 1764 registered a purchase of 174 A on Countyline Creek.
  4. John Jr/Sr may have purchased land at the the same time as Thomas but it's not clear where the land was and later there was a different John Rice in Orange Co So John's arrival date can not be determined.
  5. Hezekiah came by 1771 when he became a Lt Captain in the militia under his cousin Nathaniel Hart.
  6. Thomas Rice (CB) came in 1775 according to his son William H Rice's Rev War Pension Application.
  7. The brothers James and John and their sister Mary Rice Haggard and her husband probably came not long before 1777. They are in the 1777 tax list with James having the 174 A from his cousin Thomas Jr/Esq/Sheriff. John has no land in Oct but by Dec has some land. Edmund Haggard has some land. But the land they ended up with in later taxes came from their Grand Deeds applied for in 1778/9 with exception that James still had the 174 A he got from his cousin Thomas along with his Grant Deeds lands.
  8. Because deed books for Orange County were destroyed we only have the simple registration of land through 1768 in Orange Co then nothing ts until Caswell records started in 1777 we can not get precise dates when they obtained the land until Caswell Co.
  9. Susannah Rice Hart is said to have died in Caswell. John Sr, Thomas Esq, Thomas CB, and Hezekiah all died in Caswell. Brothers James and John sold their land within a month of each other late 1797 with James moving to Logan Co KY and John to Davidson TN and then Wilson Co TN, It is said Mary Rice Haggard died in Caswell before her husband Edmund moved to KY.
  10. Many families associated with by narriage in subsequant generations in Caswell also came from Hanover such as the Goochs.

The map is to show which countries various members of the family lived in the 1700s in Virginia

Henrico - Thomas & Marcy original home
Hanover - the family moved to northern part William, James, Thomas, John, & Edward got grant deeds
late 1770s David's son Jesse and his 2 sons
an unk Nathaniel
an unk Charles who moves to Louisa
Louisa - living in Hanover but land in Louisa: Thomas, John, Edward
living in Louisa Thomas son William, John Jr, Edward's son Charles who moves to Goochland
an unk Charles who moved from Hanover to Louisa
an unk Charles and Martha who moved to Cumberland VA
an unk Hezekiah b ca 1730- could be the one who went to Caswell
an unk Hezekiah b ca 1750 who is likely Charles Sr's son who went to Union SC
Nicholas Rice grandson of Nicholas Mills Sr
Albemarle - Mary Rice Garland, Edward Jr, Hezekiah, Tandy
Bedford - David sons Rev David, William B, Benjamin
Prince Edward - Matthew & Joseph
Campbell - David's grandson Jesse
Culpeper - William Jr
Cumberland -
Amelia -
Chesterfield -
Goochland - Edward & sons Edward & Charles and Charles son William
Fluvanna - Charles Sr (in 85) & sons Tandy & John
Powhatan - Charles Jr


This is a map of eastern Louisa and northwest Hanover Counties VA. The green diagonal line is the county boundary. It has Land Patents of several of Thomas and Marcy's children and others with descendants who married Rice's. It does not contain normal land sales - just sales from the government. There are also neighbors whose descendants likely married into the family but the tree is not clear and they are not included. They can be added as more information emerges

  1. Thomas and Marcy children: William, Thomas, John, and Edward and daughters Thomas and Susannah Rice Hart (his father's land), and John and Mary Rice Sims.
  2. Allied Families: Robert Sercey daughter Susanna married David Rice,
  3. Nicholas Mills had a grandson Nicholas Rice (many assume Nicholas Mills's daughter is Jane first wife of Thomas Jr/Esq of Caswell),
  4. Richard Estes daughter Lettisha married John's son John Jr/Sr of Caswell NC
  5. James Garland married Mary Rice
  6. Edward Bullock had 3 children who married 3 Rices: Clifton, Hezekiah, and Ann Rice
  7. Matthew Jouet's daughter Nancy Jouett married Hezekiah Rice of Caswell NC
  8. Benjamin Sanders son Thomas married David's daughter Elizabeth Rice.
  9. Philip Higgison's granddaughter married William Rice son of Thomas Rice CB of Caswell NC
  10. William Hix may be the father of the 2 Hix daughters Judith and Alice who married the 2 sons of David - Jesse and James Rice.

The tool used to map these Land Patents is DeedMapper>

Time Line

  1. 11 Jul 1719 Thomas Rice Land Patent Hanover
  2. 18 Feb 1722/23 William Rice Land Patent Hanover
  3. 24 Mar 1725/26 John Rice Land Patent Hanover
  4. 26 Jun 1731 Edward Rice Land Patent Louisa and Thomas Rice Land Patent Louisa
  5. 25 Aug 1731John Rice Land Patent Louisa and Thomas Rice Land Patent Louisa
  6. 11 Apr 1732 Thomas Rice Land Patent Louisa
  7. 28 Jan 1733/4 John Rice Land Patent Hanover
  8. 26 Feb 1733/4 - 6 Dec 1734 William Rice Sr dies
  9. 20 Jul 1736 Thomas Rice Land Patent Louisa
  10. 1 Feb 1743 Matthew Rice a resident of Hanover buys land Amelia/Prince Edward Co
  11. 2 Apr 1744 - 28 Jan 1745/6 Thomas Rice Sr dies
  12. 12 Jan 1746 Joseph Rice buys land Amelia/Prince Edward Co
  13. 1759 Susannah Rice Hart and her fmaily move to Orange/Caswell Co
  14. Feb 1764 Thomas Rice Jr/Esq/Sherriff (Thmas Sr) buys land Orange/Caswell Co. John Rice Jr/Sr (John Rice Sr) may also have purchased land then
  15. by 1771 Hezekiah Rice joins the militia of his Hart cousin Orange/Caswell Co
  16. 1775 Thomas Rice CB (John Rice Sr) moves to Orange/Caswell Co
  17. by 1777 John Rice Jr/Sr (John Rice Sr) James Rice (David), John Rice (David) are all in Caswell Co when Caswell is created from Orange Co
  18. 1783-6 Hezekiah Rice (Charles, Edward) moves to Union Co KY
  19. late 1797 James Rice (David) moves to Logan Co KY, John Rice (David) moves to Davidson Co then Wilson Co TN
  20. 3 Nov 1813 Jesse Rice Jr (Jesse Sr, David) buys land from his Aunt Sabra Hix Morris in Campbell Co VA

Sons and Daughters of Thomas and Marcy

Gen 2 William Rice Sr Will Elizabeth
Birth ca 1684 New Kent VA    
Death 26 Feb 1733/4- 6 Dec 1734 Hanover VA    
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    
  1. William Rice Jr
  2. David Rice
  3. Shadrach Rice
  4. Micajah Rice

Details for this family found on detailed page for William Rice Sr

Gen 2 James Rice  
Birth 4 Apr 1686(B) New Kent VA    
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    

Comments

Gen 2 Thomas Rice Sr Joyce
Birth 24 Jun 1688 New Kent County, VA
Death 2 Apr 1744-28 Jan 1745/6  
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    
  1. Thomas Rice Jr/Esq/Sheriff b. by 1723 d. 13 Oct 1800 Justice. Sheriff of Caswell Co, Rev War vet (will - names eldest children )
  2. William Rice d. by 1788 Louisa Co VA m. Jane d. after 1789

Details for this family found on detailed page for Thomas Rice Sr

Gen 2 Edward Rice Sr will Mary ?Claiborne
Birth 17 Apr 1690(B)      
Death 1 May 1769 - 15 Oct 1770 Goochland, VA 1789 Goochland Co., VA
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    
  1. *Charles Rice b. 25 Nov 1715 St. James Parish, Henrico VA d. by 22 Nov 1785 Goochland, VA m. Mary Holman
  2. Claiborne Rice Sr b. ca 1720 d. 1793, in Campbell, VA buried Amherst VA m. 18 Jan 1749 Susannah *Edward Rice Jr m. Ann Ryan
  3. *Edward Rice Jr m. Ann Ryan
  4. Millly Rice witness in 1750 when Edward sells land to Charles.
  5. *Judith Rice m. Michael Smith
  6. *female m. ? Baker
  7. ?? Mary Rice b. 13 Oct 1732 Hanover m. 1745 James Garland Sr d. 1812 Albemarle VA

Details for this family found on detailed page for Edward Rice Sr

Gen 2 John Sims/Symes Mary Rice
Birth     15 Jul 1694(B)  
Death        
Parents     Thomas Rice Marcy

Comments

Gen 2 John Rice2 Sr Haplogroup R-FGC17108 Mary
Birth 18 Sep 1698 New Kent County, VA 8 Jul 1765-13 Nov 1769 Hanover VA
Death after 13 Nov 1769 Hanover VA
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    
  1. John Rice Jr/Sr b. by 1725 m. Lettisha "Lettie" Estes d. 1797-1804 Will
  2. Thomas Rice b. Hanover VA d. by Oct 1804 Cabin Branch (CB), Hogan's Creek, Caswell Co, NC m. ?Marcy ?Higgason Will

Details for this family found on detailed page for John Rice Sr

Gen 2 ? Alice Rice
Birth     27 Sep 1700  
Parents     Thomas Rice Marcy

Comments

Gen 2 ? Marcy Rice
Birth     5 Jul 1702  
Parents     Thomas Rice Marcy

Comments

Gen 2 David Rice Sr Susannah Searcy
Birth ca 1704      
Death        
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy Abraham 'Robert' Searcy (1670-1734) Sarah Bell (1680-1735)
  1. Jesse Rice Sr b. ca 1730 Hanover VA d. ca 1810-1811 m. Judith (Juda) Hix (Hicks) (sister of Alice Hix who married James below)
  2. Martha Rice b. ca 1732 m. Zachariah Haggard d. Nov 1760
  3. Mary Rice b. ca 1732 Stafford VA d. 1782 Caswell NC m. Edmund Haggard d. 1 Apr 1811 Otter Creek, Madison, KY
  4. Rev David Rice Jr b. 20 Dec 1733 Hanover d. 18 Jun 1816 Green County, KY m.  June 1753 Bedford VA Mary Blair
  5. James Rice Esq b. 6 Jul 1736 VA d. 8 Dec 1809 m. Alice Hix (Hicks) b. 8 Apr 1742 d. after James (sister of Judith Hix who married Jesse Rice)
  6. Elizabeth Rice b. ca 1740 Hanover County, VA d. 1790 Bedford County, VA m. Thomas Saunders b, JUNE 1739 Hanover VA d. 1808 Brunswick, VA
  7. William B Rice b. 24 Apr 1744 Hanover VA d. 1 Mar 1838 Montgomery County, MO m.  31 Aug 1781 Prince edward Co VA Rebecca Arlington (Allington) b. 1 Mar 1758 d. 28 Jun 1846 Montgomery County, MO He had no middle name - only the iniial B
  8. John Rice b. ca 1746 d. JUL 1822(W) m. Mary Rice daughter of John Rice Sr of Caswell Co NC
  9. Benjamin Rice b. ca 1748 Hanover VA d. 27 Nov 1827 Bedford VA m. 1768 Catherine Holt d. 1789 Will m. 8 Dec 1790 Mrs. Henry
  10. ???? Questionable Many trees have Mary Rice b. 13 Oct 1732 Hanover m. 1745 James Garland Sr. d. 1812 Albemarle VA

Details for this family found on detailed page for David Rice Sr

Gen 2 Thomas Hart Jr Susannah Rice
Birth 8 May 1680 Willing-don, East Sussex, England ca 1706 New Kent County, VA
Death 1755 Hanover VA ca 1785 Caswell Co NC
Parents Thomas Hart Thomas Rice Marcy
  1. Keziah Ann Hart b. ca 1725 Hanover County, VA d. ca 1770 m. William James Gooch
  2. Thomas Hart III d. 23 Jun 1808 m. Susanna Grey
  3. John Hart
  4. Benjamin Hart m. NC Nancy Morgan
  5. David Hart m. Susannah Nunn
  6. Nathaniel Hart Sr b. 1734 d. 1782 m. NC Sarah Simpson 2000 acres in Translyvania KY Resided Red House Caswell Co 1779 moved to

Details for this family found on detailed page for Sussanah Rice Hart

Gen 2 Matthew Rice chancery suit Ann ? and Ann McGehee
Birth ca 1708 New Kent, VA    
Death by May 1775 Prince Edward, VA 1816  
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    
  1. by first wife Ann
    1. Matthew Rice Jr b. ca 1735 Prince Edward Co VA d. by 24 Sep 1810 Halifax VA m. Margaret Lewellan will
    2. Charles Rice d. by Aug 1779 Prince Edward Co VA m. Frances
    3. Nathan Rice, b 1738 d. 18 Mar 1817 Muhlenberg, KY m. 1752 Lavinia Crenshaw
    4. William Rice Sr , b 1742 d. 16 Mar 1824 Bancroft, Muhlenberg County, KY m. Frances Grainger Crenshaw
    5. John RIce by 1745 d. by 5 Mar 1805 Charlotte VA m. Elizabeth
    6. James Rice b. by1741 m. Mary

  2. by 2nd wife Ann McGehee
    1. Benjamin Rice, b ca 1755 headed west 1787/8 d. ? 1823 Garrard, KY m. Mary Burks
    2. Sarah Rice d. 1832 KY m. Charles Burks
    3. Anna Catherine Rice b ca 1760 d. DEC 1829 Garrad County, KY m. 31 Oct 1782 Prince Edward VA Thompson Burk
    4. Mary J Rice In 1824 Livingston Co KY as a single
    5. Zachariah Rice m. 17 Jan 1789 Prince Edward Co VA Elizabeth Lewis
    6. Drucilla Rice m. 7 Feb 1793 Prince Edward Co VA Richard Vaughan d. 1793
    7. Thomas Rice b. by 1775 d. by 19 Dec 1836 Prince Edward Co m. 25 Jan 1807 Powhatan Nancy Drake

Details for this family found on detailed page for Matthew Rice

Gen 2 ?Joseph Rice Sr Will Rachel
Birth ca 1704 New Kent County, VA
Death 16 Jun 1766 (P) Prince Edward County, VA after 1766
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    
  1. Mary Rice m. James Moore Sr b. ca 1715 Halifax VA d. after 1798 Halifax Co VA
  2. Lydia Rice b. by 1741 Amelia C VA m. 21 Jan 1761 Prince Edward Co VA Robert Farguson
  3. David Rice b. ca 1731 Amelia Co VA
  4. Icay Rice b. 1738-1744 d. 1780 Martin's Station, Burbon Co KY m. Maiden Foster
  5. Joseph Rice Jr b. 1738-1744 Amelia Co VA d. after 1796 m. Rachel
  6. Charles Rice b. 1744-1765 Amelia Co VA ??? m. 21 Dec 1785 Prince Edward Co VA Mary North
  7. William Rice b. 1744-1765 Amelia Co VA
  8. John Rice b. 1744-1765 Amelia Co VA

Details for this family found on detailed page for Joseph Rice

Gen 2 Benjamin Rice ?
Birth        
Death        
Parents Thomas Rice Marcy    

We know of his existence by Benjamin being listed by David's grandson David (son of David's son Benjamin) is one of his grandfather's brothers. Since its the same name as his father and one would assume his father was named after that uncle I assume this was accurate. Also the name Benjamin abounds in the family indicating the existence of a son Benjamin. Many trees have gone through contortions to create a time line and location for him. Some are downright bizarre and have been copied many times in ancetry.com. There are a number of Rices that do not belong in this family tree.

Details for leads evalayed for Benjamin Rices

Y-DNA - grouped by Haplogroup

Not every Rice born in Virginia is a descendant of Thomas and Marcy but many are. The following are proven to connect to Thomas and Marcy by Y-DNA testing

 

Block Tree of Haplogroups for Thomas Rice Descendants

R-FT101660

R-FGC17119
Thomas Rice of Henrico

Haplogroup R-FGC17119 represents a man who is estimated to have been born around 300 years ago, plus or minus 100 years. That corresponds to about 1700 CE with a 95% probability he was born between 1600 CE and 1800 CE. He is the most recent paternal line ancestor of all members of this group. R-FGC17119's paternal lineage branched off from R-FT101660 and the rest of mankind about 1,000 years ago, plus or minus 250 years.

R-FGC17119

Robert Phillips is the closet tester connected prior to Thomas and that common ancestor is around a thousand years ago

R-FGC17108
Thomas' son John b. 1698

Mutation first occurred in John as both sons had it

Haplogroup R-FGC17108 represents a man who is estimated to have been born around 300 years ago, plus or minus 150 years. That corresponds to about 1700 CE with a 95% probability he was born between 1550 CE and 1850 CE. He is the most recent paternal line ancestor of all members of this group. R-FGC17108's paternal lineage branched off from R-FGC17119 and the rest of mankind about 300 years ago, plus or minus 100 years.

R-FTB38469
Thomas' son Edward

Mutation first occurrence in Edward's line is unknown but likely son Charles or below

Haplogroup R-FTB38469 represents a man who is estimated to have been born around 250 years ago, plus or minus 200 years. That corresponds to about 1800 CE with a 95% probability he was born between 1600 CE and 2000 CE. He is the most recent paternal line ancestor of all members of this group. R-FTB38469's paternal lineage branched off from R-FGC17119 and the rest of mankind about 300 years ago, plus or minus 100 years.

R-M6586
Thomas' son Matthew
Nathan
Jesse

Mutation first occurrence is either Nathan or Jesse as Matthew's other sons do not carry the mutation. We have no testers for Nathan except Jesse sons so the initial mutation occurred in either Nathan or Jesse

Haplogroup R-M6586 represents a man who is estimated to have been born around 200 years ago, plus or minus 150 years. That corresponds to about 1800 CE with a 95% probability he was born between 1650 CE and 1950 CE. He is the most recent paternal line ancestor of all members of this group. R-M6586's paternal lineage branched off from R-FGC17119 and the rest of mankind about 300 years ago, plus or minus 100 years.

R-FGC17119

No unique mutations shared with any other decendant of Thomas and Marcy

New testers are apt to break this group up.

Haplogroup R-FGC17119

This group is the top level and anyone in this group may come from any son except John because there are not unique identifiers linking them to indicate all are one son.

  1. R-FGC17119 Line 1: MK65024 Thomas & Marcy to David and Susanna Searcy to James Rice to Hiram
  2. R-FGC17119 Line 2: 321665 Thomas & Marcy to David and Susanna Searcy to William B Rice
  3. R-FGC17119 Line 3: 241362 Thomas & Marcy to Matthew Rice to Charles Rice to Rowlette Rice
  4. R-FGC17119 Line 4: 812625 Thomas & Marcy to Matthew Rice to William Rice to Ezekiel Rice
  5. R-FGC17119 Line 5: 307339 Rev John Rice 1760 VA 1843
  6. R-FGC17119 Line 6: 975358 Thomas & Marcy to David and Susanna Searcy to James Rice to Jonathon
  7. R-FGC17119 Line 7: 204028 Thomas & Marcy to unknoown son (but likely Thomas Sr m Joyce) - to Hezikiah Rice m Mary Bullock of Caswell NC

The six Rice cousin/siglings of Caswell County

There are 6 Rices of southeastern Caswell County. John, Thomas Cabin Branch of St David's District , James, John of Gloucester District , Justice/Sheriff Thomas and Capt Hezekiah of St David's District . There is a John Rice in the northeast but he is unrelated. These 6 men are grandsons of Thomas and Marct Rice of Hanover. Between DNA testing and paper trail 5 can be assigned to a specific son.

  1. John and Thomas Cabin Branch are bothers and sons of John Sr y-dna proven
  2. James and John are brothers and sons of David paper trail
  3. Sheriff/Justice Thomas m. Jane/Abigail is son of Thomas m. Joyce paper trail
  4. Capt Hezekiah is still not proven but we know by Y-DNA he is not a son of John nor based on paper trail. a son of David Thomas and Hezekiah were the first grandsons to arrive in Caswell when it was still Orange County and they lived near each other just as John's sons lived near each other as did David;s sons. It is likely Hezekiah and Sheriff/Justice Thomas were brothers. There is no trace of Benjamin son of Thomas and Marcy in any records any where except a paper trail mention of his existence by a grandson of David. Some trees have Benjamin as his middle name. No records indicate Capt Hezekiah had a middle name of Benjamin. Men did not have such middle names when he was born. His middle names got added creatively a couple of decades ago by people trying to support a hypothesis and is not based on any factual record. A number of Rice males got middle names added during that period. We will continue to look for a y-dna tested for a Thomas descendant.

Capt. Hezekiah Rice b. ca 1732 VA d. 1796 Caswell Co NC m. Mary Bullock

  1. Gideon Rice b. 1758
    1. Churchwell Rice b. 1776-1780 m. 15 Sep 1801 Craven Polly Jones m. 17 Nov 1804 Craven Siner Riggs or Senie Biggs m.31 Jan 1812 Craven Mary Sawyer d. 1844 Craven
      1. Spenser Riceb. 1808
      2. Dempsey Rice
      3. Gideon Rice
    2. Dempsey Rice lost at sea no children
  2. Annis Rice b. 4 Mar 1759 m. 26 Feb 1783 Caswell NC witness Hezekiah Rice Capt John Oldham b. 10 Nov 1757 Prince Edward VA d. 17 Nov 1831Estill County, KY Rev War Pension
    1. Abner Oldham
    2. Absalom Oldham
    3. Hezekiah Oldham
    4. Caleb Oldham
    5. Mary Oldham
    6. Sarah Oldham
    7. Elizabeth Oldham
    8. Nancy Oldham
    9. John Rice Oldham
    10. John M Oldham
  3. Ibzan Rice Sr b. 26 Jun 1760 d. 1847 Caswell Co. NC m. 27 Feb 1796 Caswell NC Dolly G. Carlos m. 8 Dec 1818 Polley Brooks m. 5 May 1824 Ursley Brooks Estate
    1. Martha G Rice b. 1793 d. 25 Aug 1855 McDowell County, NC m. 10 Aug 1818 Caswell Dennis Wilson d. 8 Sep 1880 Raleigh, NC
      1. R. Don Wilson
      2. Franklin Inge "Frank" Wilson
      3. Frances Jane Wilson
      4. Mary E. Wilson
      5. Emily Ruth Wilson
      6. Martha Laura Wilson
    2. Dorothy Carlos Rice b. 1805 d. after 1880 m. 7 Jun 1823 Caswell Jonathan Brooks Watlington b. 13 Jun 1791 d. 6 Aug 1844 lived in Monticello, Guilford Co NC then a number of them went to Bowie TX
      1. James Monroe Watlington b. 1824
      2. John Armistead Watlington b. 1826
      3. William Paul Watlington b. 1828
      4. Thomas Jefferson Watlington b. 1830
      5. Edward D Watlington b. 1832
      6. Alexander Rice Watlington b. 1 Apr 1834 d. 24 Jun 1841
      7. Lt Robert Henry Watlington b. 16 Jan 1841 NC d. 12 May 1921 New Boston, Bowie, TX served civil war confederate
    3. Frances/ Fanny B Rice b. 1800-1810 d. 1840-1850 m. 24 May 1825 Caswell d. by 1850 m. Anderson Willis b. 1b01 d. 1865 John Rice attorney
      1. Laura A Willi m. Graves m. James W Henry
      2. Elizabeth Willi m. Thornton T Baynes
    4. Elizabeth Rice b. 1808 m. 8 Jun 1832 Caswell Richard Carter Stubblefield - in 1860 Concord, Calloway, KY
      1. William Monroe Rufus Lafayette Stubblefield
      2. Richard Carter Ibzan Stubblefield
      3. Lacy Ann Amanda Stubblefield
      4. John Carter Stubblefield
      5. Samuel Earl Stubblefield
      6. Alfred Bethel Stubblefield
      7. Elizabeth Virginia Frances Stubblefield
    5. Ibzan Rice Jr b. Oct 1820 Caswell Co, NC d. 29 Nov 1887 Pittslyvania, VA m. 13 Dec 1849 Emeline Totten
      1. William F. Rice
      2. Thomas Jefferson Rice
      3. Sallie A. Rice
      4. John H. Rice
      5. Albert E. Rice
      6. Elizabeth Baines Rice
      7. Marcellus L. Rice
    6. Amanda Rice
    7. Louisa Rice
    8. C.R. Rice minor in 1848 Richard Jones friend
    9. Hezekiah Rice minor in 1848 Richard Jones friend
  4. Milly Rice b. ca 1761 d. after 1850 m. 25 Nov 1786 Caswell m. John Calles/Chilles resided Madison, KY
    1. Ann Rice b. 1805 NC
    2. Nancy Rice b. 1807 NC
  5. Leut. Jeptha Rice b. ca 1762 Albemarle County VA d. Sep 1821 Gallatin, Sumner County TN m. 19 Aug 1784 Caswell Nancy Jouett Rev War Pension in Caswell 1811 Davidson TN
    1. Baldwin Rice b. 28 Jul 1787 Caswell Co d. 13 Aug 1847 in Hardin, TN
    2. Mary/Polly Rice b. 13 Aug 1788 d. 17 Sep 1854 Hardin County, T m. Levi Smith
    3. Elizabeth Rice b. 1796 Caswell, NC d. 1853 in Mcnairy, T m. William Ponds
    4. Matthew Rice b. 1800 m. 10 Feb 1823 Sumner TN Sally Ponds
    5. P Kenas Rice b. 1798 d. 1826 TN m. Mary Pond
    6. Avery Rice b. 1805 d. 1 Aug 1859 m. Perry Smith
    7. Joseph Henry Rice b. 1803 Caswell Co NC d. 1 Aug 1859 in Caldwell Co TX m. 22 Jan 1827 in Sumner Co TN Malissa Ambrose
    8. Martha/Patsy Rice ca 1798 d. 21 Jan 1866 Hendersonville, Sumner Co TN m. 9 Jul 1823 Sumner, TN Elisha Gibson
  6. Hezekiah Rice Jr b. 5 Feb 1764 Albemarle County, VA d. 16 Jan 1860 Belton, Anderson, SC m. 5 Apr 1787 Bedford Co VA Nancy/Polly Leftwich moved to SC
    1. Mary "Polly" Rice
    2. Ibzan Rice
    3. Thomas Leftwich Rice
    4. Rev Amaziah Rice
    5. Asenath Rice m. Rev William McGee
    6. Hezekiah Rice III
    7. Louisa Rice McGee
    8. Fleetwood Rice 1 Mar 1809 - Pendelton District, Anderson, South Carolina, USA d. 23 Nov 1866 - Tyler, Smith, TX Haplogroup R-FGC17119 #204028
    9. Irene Smith Rice m. atiner
  7. Edmond Rice b. 1770 d. 1860 Madison, AL m. 5 Dec 1795 Caswell Co NC Henrietta Rice (Parents Nathan Rice son of Thomas Rice cabin branch and Sarah Williamson) m. Sarah (liv with son Othniel 1850
    1. Othniel Rice b. 1797 Caswell, NC d. 1884 Madison, AL m. 20 Jan 1842 Mary Mooney
      1. Jo/Hickman Rice b. 1849
      2. Hugh L M Rice b. 1851
    2. James M Rice b. 1798 d. 1860 Raytown, Jackson Co MO m. Nellie Cantwell m. 3 Nov 1825 Caswell Nancy Lea Bruce
      by Nellie Cantwell
      1. Benjamin Rice b. 6 Apr 1822 d. 17 Jan 1918 Kansas City Jackson Co MO m. Jane Cox
      2. ?
      by Nancy Bruce d. 1857
      1. Mary Rice Kelley
      2. Nathaniel Rice b. 4 Apr 1828 d. 10 Jan 1892 Raytown, Jackson Co MO m. Harriett L. West, m. Serelda West - no sons
      3. William Bruce Rice b. 6 Oct 1831 d. 22 Aug 1911Jackson Co MO m. Experience Hewitt m. Ruth A. Bone
        1. James H. Rice b. 1862 Jackson Co MO d. 1939 Dickinson Co Kansas m. Jennie Shumate
        2. William Oscar Rice b. 6/7 Feb 1873 Kansas City Jackson Co MO d. 7/8 Feb 1937 Bexar Co TX
        3. William D (Riley) RICE b. 1865 MO d. 3 Feb 1929 Howard County, TX (DNA proves his parents were not Henry Wise RICE and Abigail RICE)
      4. Ellen 1839-1896
      5. Caroline Rice Hot
      6. James Rice (died in civil war)
      7. Littleton b. 1847
      8. George W 1849
      9. Caroline 1850-1898
    3. Sarah Rice
    4. Mary Lucinda Rice d. Aug 1849 Sumner, TN m. Joseph B. (Ghormley) Gormley
    5. Henrietta Rice d. 1850 Madison, AL
  8. Othniel Rice b. 27 Aug 1771 NC d. 23 Feb 1853 Fayette County, AL m. Sarah Williamson moved to Pendleton District SC then by 1839 AL
    1. Nancy Jane Rice
    2. Hezekiah Rice
    3. James S Rice b. 20 Sep 1799 Anderson County, SC d. 8 Jan 1881 New Lexington, Tuscaloosa County, AL
    4. Sally/Sarah Rice b. 9 Jan 1807 SC d. 13 Nov 1871 Fayette County, AL m. Green Mercer Richards
    5. Jeptha Rice 20 Jun 1804 SC d. 15 Oct 1874 Fayette County, AL
    6. John Rice

Comments

  • Although many trees give him a middle name of Benjamin He had no middle name and certainly it is not known if his father is Benjamin. No records for Benjamin have been found. Hezekiah father is most likely Thomas, Edward, or even John. John Lawrence of Carteret County NC lived near Gideon, Hezekiah and Jeptha in VA according to his statement for Jeptha'S Rev War Pension.
  • He lived in Caswell Co, St David's District on Hogan's Creek near Thomas Rice Esq who is listed under Thomas Rice Sr of Hanover. He served in the Revolutionary Way under one of his Hart cousins.
  • Mary Bullock's father Edward left a will naming his son-in-law Clifton Rice who married his daughter Sarah Bullock as an executor. Clifton shows up in a couple of Louisa Co records as a witness. John Bullock married Ann Rice. Were Hezekiah, Clifton and Ann Rice siblings? Siblings marrying siblings was common.

 

Haplogroup R-FTB38469

  1. R-FTB38469 Line 1: 18407 Thomas & Marcy to Edward to Charles
  2. R-FTB38469 Line 2: 46459 Alexander Rice

William Rice assumed father

        1. William Rice b 1813 VA m. Fannie Qualls they are associated with Overton and White Co TN
          1. George Washington Rice b. Jun 1836 Overton, TN
          2. Pvt. James Alexander Rice b. 27 Dec 1842 Overton County, TN
          3. Ameda Leander T Rice b. 6 Oct 1852 Overton County, TN
          4. James Morgan (Jim) Rice b. 8 Feb 1867 Overton, TN
        2. Alexander Rice b.1807 VA d.15 Mar 1862 Scyene, Dallas Co TX m. 27 Nov 1840 Rhea County TN Lucinda Taylor
          1. Amedia Rice b. ca 1831 d. after 1875 m. Emily he remained in Meigs Co TN until his death in 1875. His family went to and are associated with Scott Co Arkansas Served Civil War
            1. Alexander Rice
            2. Frances A Rice
            3. David Rice
            4. Samuel Chester H Rice b. 2 May 1857 TN d. 25 Sep 1914 Scott, AR m. Vashti Othella "Vesta" Haplogroup R-M269
            5. Amedia William Rice
            6. John Rice
            7. Margarette Rice
            8. Mary A Rice
            9. Emily Rice
            10. Bard Rice
          2. Alexander Rice b. ca 1835
          3. George Washington. Rice b Sep 1843 TN d. 8 Dec 1915 Dallas TX m. 3 Dec 1878 Henrietta Smith or Verhein
            1. Ernest Linwood Rice
            2. George Washington Rice b1879 TX d 1954 TX
            3. Alexander Lee Rice
          4. Almira Rice b Sep 1843 TN
          5. Mary M Rice m. 10 Dec 1879 Henry Stedman
          6. Martha Rice
          7. Andrew Jackson Rice b. 26 May 1847 d. 29 Nov 1910 Dallas TX m. Sarah Jane Griffin
            1. John Woodie Rice
          8. Cecelia Rice b.. Jun 1850 d. after 1910 single
          9. Melisan Hattie Elizabeth Rice b. Jun 1854 d. 2 Feb 1918 Ft Worth TX m. William Harrison Griffin
            1. William H Griffin
            2. Eugene Griffin
            3. Ula B Griffin
            4. Myrtle Griffin
            5. Pearl Griffin
      1. Comments
        1. Tax lists in 1833 Rhea County included Meigs and lists both William and Alexander. Meigs County was formed by the Tennessee legislature in 1836 from parts of Rhea County. In 1836 they are both listed under Meigs. Other Rices in Rhea Samuel R Rice & John 1819, Elijah Rice & John 1825, Jasy Rice 1833, T. B. Rice 1837
        2. Alexander married 1st Margaret Price 27 Oct 1825 Rhea County, TN
      Haplogroup R-M6586

This group is in Matthew Rice line through son Nathan then Jesse but its undetermined how far down the tree the mutation occured as they are all down the tree

  1. R-M6586 Line 1: 282422 Thomas & Marcy to Matthew Rice to Nathan Rice to Jesse Rice
  2. R-M6586 Line 2: 56748 Thomas & Marcy to Matthew Rice to Nathan Rice to Jesse Rice
  3. R-M6586 Line 3: 4086 Thomas & Marcy to Matthew Rice to Nathan Rice to Jesse Rice

Haplogroup R-FGC17108

3 of the 4 testers (one is unknown) are through 2 sons of John's (John Jr/Sr and Thomas CB) so its assumed the mutation occured in John and all his sons will have it.
  1. R-FGC17108 Line 1: 153550 unknown but descends through John b. 18 Sep 1698 and NOt his son John Jr/Sr of Cassell NC
  2. R-FGC17108 Line 2: 680588 Thomas & Marcy to John Rice Sr to John Rice Jr/Sr to Nathaniel Rice to Archibald Elihu Rice
  3. R-FGC17108 Line 3: 163337 Thomas & Marcy to John Rice Sr to John Rice Jr/Sr to William to Nathaniel Rice b. 1788
  4. R-FGC17108 Line 4: 4897 Thomas & Marcy to John Rice Sr to Thomas Rice CB to Joel C Rice to James David Rice to David Lafayette Rice
  5. R-FGC17108 Line 5: 20980 Humphrey Posey Rice b.1820 SC d. 1880 m. 11 Feb 1841 Cherokee Co GA Leviny Kuykendall b. NC 1850-1870 Census, GA Cherokee Co Salacoa District 1880 Census, GA Whitfield Co Dalton
    1. Martha Jane Rice b. 1842
    2. John Calvin Rice b. 1843
    3. Franklin Cass Rice 1845
    4. Sarah A Rice 1846
    5. Lewis Cass Rice 1847
    6. Laura b. 1849
    7. Amanda Carelin Rice b. 1851
    8. Mary A b. 1853
    9. Susannah b. 1854
    10. Dicey L Rice b. 1859
      1. James/Jefferson Francisco Rice b. 1862

    6. A find of Grave for Humphrey says his parrents were John Phillips Rice b. 9 Jun 1797 d. 20 May 1866 Ripley Lauderdale Co TN m. Rachel Rowell b. 19 Nov 1808 SC d. 5 Nov 1858 Durhamville, Lauderdale County, TN. But Rachel Rowell would have been 12 when Humphrey would have been born and there is no obvious connection.

    There are a number of Rices in who lived in Cherokee Co GA when Humphey married there. A possible father for Humphrey is David Rice is old enough and living there in 1840 a year befoe Humphery married. Accuracy ofchildren not verified.

    David Rice b. 1785 NC or SC d. after 1850 David Rices of the right age lived in SC 1820: David Rice in York, David in Barnwell SC, and David in Greenville. A David in Barnwell still there in 1840
    1840-1850 Cherokee Co GA

        1. Anna Rice b. 1815 SC m. 12 Apr 1842 Cherokee Co GA Levi 1815
        2. Elizabeth Rice b. 1815 m. 15 Aug 1840 Elisha P. Bomar
        3. Caroline b. 1817 m. 5 Nov 1846 William Craig
        4. Thomas b. 1818 SC
        5. Jerry b.1819
        6. Humphrey b. 1820
        7. Permilla b. 1823
        8. Nancy b. 1827 m. 2 Aug 1849 Philman Foster
        9. Josiah Rice b. 1831
        10. Benjamin M Rice b. 1831 m. 5 Jan 1851 Easter Young enrolled in navy Jan 1864 at IL 1960 Randolph, AL
        11. James David Rice b. 1844 (?a grandson)

Haplogroup R-M269 Group 4 of the Rice Y-DNA project.

A catch all of all those in the Thomas and Marcy group but testers below the Big-Y. Upgrading to a Big Y may help determine more information.

The folowing are closely related

Line 2 Rev John Rice Haplogroup R-FGC17119

  1. Rev John Rice b. 6 Feb 1760 Prince Edward Co VA d. 19 Mar 1843 Shakertown Mercer KY m. 17 Mar 1781 Halifax VA Elizabeth Hundley He served in the Rev War. After the war he returned to VA. He joined the Baptists at Catawba 1785 in Halifax County, and was baptized by William Datson. He brought his little family to KY and in 1788 to Shawnee Run Mercer KY .All the dates in barious sourcrs are conflicting. He was a member of Gilberts Creek church of Separate Baptists Garrard Co., KY where he was ordained to the gospel. This church had been constituted the year before. Soon after he was ordained by John Baley, Robert Elkin, Joseph Bledsow, and Martin Haggard. A hstory states he baptised his own father who was a Prespeterian, his wife and 8 children.
    1. Mary Rice b. 24 Nov 1785 d. 12 Feb 1864 Mercer Co KY m. 22 Oct 1801, Mercer County, KY Joseph Thomas Hedger
      1. Mary Rice m. John R Hedger
    2. Nancy Rice, b. Abt. 1788; d. Bef. 1844, Shelby County, Kentucky; m. 6 Feb 1806, Mercer John Rigg
    3. Anderson Rice b. 1794 never married
    4. William b. 1795 KY m. Mary
      1. Martha
      2. John
      3. Anne/Martha
    5. Elizabeth Rice b. 1798 Franklin County, KY m. Barton Harris
    6. Joseph L Rice b. 1802 Shakertown Mercer, KY d. Nelson Co KY m. Amanda Jane Garret b. 1817 Nelson Co KY d. 27 Feb 1858 - Nelson, KY
      1. William T Rice b. 18 Jun 1848 Nelson Co, KY d. 25 Apr 1930 Nelson County, KY m. America Greenwell 5 Oct 1848 KY d. 4 Feb 1915 Bullitt, KY & Haplogroup R-FGC17119 #307339
    7. Casandra Rice b. 1804 m. 5 Jan 1837 Andrew Jackson “Jack” Steenbergen b. 15 Feb 1815 Barren Co KY d. 17 Dec 1875 Mercer County, KY
    8. Sarah/Sallie Rice b. 1805 never married liv Anderson Co. KY in 1850
    9. Mariah W Rice 7 Feb 1807Mercer Co KY d. 02 Sep 1840, Mercer Co KY m. Fredrich Bradshaw

Line 3 Jehu M Rice - John Jehu M. Rice b.@1775-1780 d. 1847

1800, 1801, 1802 there is a Jehu with out the M in Montgomery Co KY tax records. Some have tried to connect him to the James and Joseph in Mercer. That may be but Jehu lived in a different part of the county - a Henry is closer to Jehu.
1810 Sumner Co William Rice constable
1820 Gallatin, 1780 Sumner Co TN Jehu M Rice 26-45 b. 1775 - 1794 liv by Joshua Rice 16-25 & Nathl (not Nathan) Rice 26-45 (2 males less than 10) William Rice 45 up Kinagah Rice 45 up Nancy Rice
1821 Wilson Co Jehu M Rice witnessed some thing
1824 Sumner Tax List Jehu M Rice William Joseph Keiras John Joshua Nathaniel
1830 Sumner Co TN William Rice Sr b, 1761-1770 William Rice Jr 20-29 Mary Rice 20-29 & some younger males Matthew Rice b. 1798
1838 Sumner Tax List Henry James William Polly Joseph Matthew David Thom J
1840 Joshua Rice 60-69 Joseph, Mary, James, David, Matthew, William
1830 & 40 Franklin, Illinois Jehu M Rice b. 1771-1780 so based on census b. 1775-1780

Line 4 James Rice b. 1750 Amelia Co VA d. 1835 Ky

Line 5 Charles Rice liv Madison Co, KY m. Sarah Bryan

    • 1-- Srgt. Charles RICE b. 1763? d. Madisonville, Hopkins Co KY 1809 m. 11 Jul 1786 Lincoln Co KY Sarah Bryan d. 1830) Sgt, Downing (Capt James Downing) Co, Lincoln County, Mil. Rev. War enlisted 24 Oct-24 Nov 1782 for action against Indians under General George Rogers Clark
      Charles first appears in Madison Cunty when he buys land in Aug 1797. The dd dows list his residence. He does not appear in tax lists prior to buying the land so he probably lived else where in KY before buying the land but the 1850 census does indicate son James was born in Madison.
    •          2-- James RICE-3 (1787-1863) b. Madison ,Kentucky liv. Richmond, Madison KY m. 19 Oct 1815 Elizabeth TURNER-12 (1797-1862)  Madison,Kentucky
    •              3-- Fountain RICE-21 (1816-1891)  Kentucky m. Milanda BOGGS-37 (1823-1899)  Kentucky
    •                  4-- Taylor RICE-45 (1846-    )  Madison County,Kentucky
    •                  4-- James RICE-46 (1841-    )  Madison County,Kentucky
    •                  4-- Fountain RICE-47 (1844-    )  Madison County,Kentucky
    •                  4-- Theodocia S. RICE-48 (1846-    )  Madison County,Kentucky
    •                  4-- Richard S. RICE-49 (1849-    )  Madison County,Kentucky
    •                  4-- David C. RICE-50 (1851-    )  Madison County,Kentucky
    •                  4-- Edmund RICE-52 (1853-    )
    •                  4-- Robert RICE-53 (1863-    )  Kentucky
    •              3-- Silas RICE-22 (1818-1868)  m. Unk ROBINSOM-38 (1821-    )
    •              3-- Martin RICE-23 (1820-    m. Mary Ann ADAMS-39 (1823-    )  Kentucky
    •              3-- Anne RICE-24 (    -    )
    •              3-- Sallie RICE-25 (    -    )
    •              3-- James RICE-26 (1825-1871)  Madison,Kentucky
    •              3-- Meredith RICE-27 (1826-    )  Madison,Kentucky m. Kate NELSON-40 (1829-    )  Kentucky
    •              3-- Elizabeth J. RICE-28 (1828-    )  Madison,Kentucky m. J. F. DICKERSON-41 (    -    )
    •              3-- Mary RICE-29 (1830-1851)
    •              3-- William RICE-30 (1832-1866)  Madison,Kentucky
    •              3-- Samuel RICE-31 (1833-    )  Madison,Kentucky m. Susan EASLEY-42 (    -    )
    •              3-- Thomas RICE-32 (1838-    )  Madison,Kentucky
    •              3-- Robert RICE-33 (1837-    )  Madison,Kentucky
    •              3-- Charles Walker RICE-34 (1839-1913)  Madison County, Kentucky
    •               m. Nannie DUERSON-43 (1845-1927) Madison County, Kentucky
    •                         4-Monte T. Rice (1869 -   ) Madison County, Kentucky m. Alice Sutton 
    •                         4-Ollie W. Rice (1871-  ) Johnson County, Missouri               
    •                         4-Leslie Duerson Rice (1874-1955) Johnson County, Missouri m. Anna Julia Morrow (1883-1974) Newton County, Missouri
    •                                     5-John Morrow Rice (1917-1993) Newton County, Missouri m. Kay Adkins (1916-1999) McDonald County, Missouri
    •                                                 6-John Morrow Rice Jr. (1944-   ) Seattle, WA   Haplogroup R-M269   #19119
    •                                                 6-David Adkins Rice (1947-    ) Newton County, Missouri
    •                         4-Hugh C. Rice (1876-   ) Johnson County, Missouri m. Allie Hilbert
    •              3-- Judith RICE-35 (1840-    )  Madison,Kentucky
    •              3-- Nancy RICE-36 (1843-    )  Madison,Kentucky    m. John MILLER-44 (    -    )
    •          2-- Ichabod RICE-4 (1789-1876) m. Polly JOHNSON-13 (    -    )
    •          2-- William RICE-5 (1791-    )
    •          2-- Bryant RICE-7 (1793-    )  m. Elizabeth CANOTE-15 (    -    )
    •          2-- Sarah RICE b. 25 Jul 1793   d.  26 Dec 1873 m. 3 Jan 1811 Madison KY James Geery
    •          2-- Mary RICE-9 (1797-    )   m. William WALKER-17 (    -    )
    •          2-- Rachel Rebecca RICE b. 29 Mar 1798 d. 26 Jun 1870 m. Joseph Cambell
    •          2-- Charles RICE-6 (1800-    )  Madison,Kentucky   m. Fanny RUCKER-14 (    -    )
    •          2-- Elizabeth RICE-11 (1801-    ) m. David GILLESPIE-19 (    -    )
    •          2--? Katy RICE-20 (1803-    )

Line 6 Joseph Rice, b 12 Feb 1790, d. 16 Mar 1845 - he may or not be related to above group

  1. Joseph Rice, b 12 Feb 1790, d. 16 Mar 1845 Warrick Co IN m. 17 Nov 1809 Warren, KY Fanny Broadfield Will Clarissa Bradwell b. 1800 SC might be Fanny's sister. They moved to Indiana 1817
    1. Axley Rice b. 27 AUG 1811 Bowling Green, Warren Co KY d. 23 JUN 1896 Lynnville, Warrick Co IN m. Eleanor Hunsaker
      1. Sarah Rice Age 16
      2. Jepperson Rice Age 12
      3. Joseph Rice Age 10
      4. Washington Rice Age 7
      5. Miles Rice Age 5
      6. Henry Rice Age 4
      7. Daniel Rice Age 2
      8. Laura Rice Age 2
    2. Miles b. 1814 m. 15 May 1845 Warrick Co IN Lydia Dawson
      1. Sarah A Rice 13 1860
      2. Mary F Rice 11
      3. Arminda E Rice 7
      4. Joseph A Rice
      5. Elizabeth Rice 24 1880
      6. Tillman L. Rice 18
      7. Susan S. Rice 15
      8. Lorena Rice 14
    3. Union Rice b. 25 Oct 1816 d. 25 Oct 1896 m. Margaret
      1. Eli 1840
      2. William
      3. Matilda
      4. Frances
      5. Clarissa
      6. Albert L Rice 7 1860
      7. Franklin L Rice 6
      8. Miles N Rice
      9. Warrick Rice

R-M269 Line 7 823 John Henry Rice, 1823 Bedford Co. TN

  1. John H. Rice b. 23 May 1828 TN d. 17 Mar 1912 Bedford Co. TN m. Lou Saidee Rice both of his parents born in VA
    1. Mitchell Henry Rice
    2. William Gordon Rice
    3. James A. Rice
    4. Charles Newton Rice
    5. Margaret Theressa Green
    6. Nannie B
    7. John Ewing Rice
    8. Bettie
    9. Edward Cooper Rice
    10. Lala Mae Rice